Archive for the ‘money’ Category

Stick to your time on stage

August 1, 2017

Hey Dave – Without revealing my secret identity, I heard you talking not too long ago and know you were pretty upset with a comedian who went over his time and was on stage too long. It’s probably safe to say he overstayed his welcome. Care to elaborate? – G.

Hey G – What are you a secret agent with a secret identity listening to my not-so-private conversations? Oh well, I guess it could be worse. Instead of a sleazy private eye snooping on me, you could be a self-centered comedian (or speaker) who goes over his allotted time on stage.

Want to kill a potentially great relationship with a comedy club or make sure you’re never invited back for a return gig at a college or corporate event?

Go ahead – ignore it!

When you’re given the light (the signal) to end your set and leave the stage – ignore it. Go ahead and do another 5, 10, 15 minutes, half an hour… an hour… Everyone will surely love and worship your amazing and boundless talent that you’re compelled to share so unselfishly for however long your ego needs to be stroked on stage.

And in case you don’t recognize sarcasm in the written word, insert a capitalized “NOT!” after that last sentence. In a creative profession that thrives on having no rules (being original and unique is a big plus) going over your time on stage breaks a big business rule – and is a big minus.

As always there are exceptions that depend on your status within the industry and everyone starting out in the business needs to realize that. There are special events where more time on stage is a benefit. For instance, fundraising efforts that are planned in advance to set records for time on stage. I remember reading about a comedian who did forty hours of stand-up years ago and raised at TON of money for a hospital. That’s truly awesome, but not what we’re talking about today.

Another exception is having your own hit television show or enough name recognition to sell out theaters and arenas. That’s like being the favorite child or grandchild. You get special privileges.

When you’re a major star and selling out arenas, theaters or (sometimes) a club and charging big $$’s for tickets, fans expect a “concert” experience and more than just a half hour or hour show by the headliner. It’s like seeing Bruce Springsteen, Paul McCartney, or U2 perform three hour concerts. Their fans are into it, paid money to see that particular artist, and these acts have the material to entertain for that length of time. But until you’re working within that stratosphere of popularity, stick to your time on stage.

Reasons why? As always, I’m glad you asked…

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Comedy Workshop at The Cleveland Improv

Showcase performance on Wednesday, August 16th at 7:30 pm

Workshop Marquee 150

Fall 2017 Chicago and Cleveland workshop dates TBA

For information, reviews, photos and advance registration visit…

TheComedyBook.com

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It’s a business, which is a fact I emphasize in many of these FAQ’s and Answers. Some club owners are in the entertainment biz because they enjoy it and like to nurture and promote new talent. Others are only in it to make money. But the bottom line for both is if they don’t make money (and yes, this includes the nurturing types) they go out of business. When a club goes out of business, comedians have one less place to work.

Clubs earn money selling tickets, selling food and drinks, and keeping expenses (rent, utilities, inventory, payroll, etc…) under control. The comedian you reminded me of in this week’s question – and I won’t mention his name – actually told club management (me at that time!) after the show that he was doing the club a favor by going more than an HOUR over his scheduled time on stage. He pretty much wanted a “thank you” for giving the serving, kitchen and bar staff more time to sell food and drinks.

That consideration for the club deserves a bigger laugh than any he received on stage. After all, Dumb and Dumber was a popular movie and now in my opinion this comic is the live version. Good thinking! (Again – this is written sarcasm so please add a big “NOT!”).

You know why? Because the business doesn’t work that way…

Shows at this particular club (a world famous comedy club, I might add) are timed. Staff arrives at a certain time, the doors open at a certain time, the show starts at a certain time and the comedians – opening act, feature act and headlining act – are given set times. The headliners, of course, are the privileged members of the family, but most know how the business works.

It’s a profit deal!

As Steve Martin said in The Jerk:

I get it… It’s a profit deal!

The behind the scenes business – kitchen crew, servers, food-runners, bars, box office, security, management – revolve around the show schedule. For instance, the box office closes when the headliner goes on so customers won’t complain about getting ripped-off by buying a ticket after the show has started. So that profit opportunity is ended when the headliner walks on stage.

Are you following me so far? Good, because I’m not done yet…

A sad fact about the nightclub biz is that some people like to skip out on their checks. In other words, if they can sneak out without paying they’re getting a free night out. The truth in most cases is that the servers – the waiters and waitresses – are stuck with these checks and have to pay for these uncollected profits out of their own pockets. They foot the bill and end up paying for these jerks (and I’m not referring again to a Steve Martin movie) to have a fun night out.

Not fair – is it?

This is why comedy clubs have “check spots.” Experienced comedians know exactly what I’m talking about. It’s when the checks are put on the tables to be paid by the customers. The show doesn’t (or shouldn’t) end until all the checks are paid – by the customers. That makes it difficult for deadbeat customers to blend in and sneak out with customers who have already paid. It’s a sad truth about the nightclub business.

So based on the time allotted for the show, last call is given when there is still enough time during the headlining comedian’s set to give customers their checks and collect the money. No more drinks or food are served after last call because the checks are closed. When the show ends and the final comedian has walked off the stage, customers can head to the bar or another club if they want to continue drinking and eating.

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This means the final two profit opportunities for the club has ended – food and drinks.

But what about keeping expenses under control? When the staff has finished serving and collecting checks, they have to hang around and wait for the show to end and the customers to leave. They’ve also lost any opportunity to make additional tips because the checks are “closed” and they can’t start new ones for thirsty customers because no one knows for sure when the show will end.

In the case of the comedian referred to above, that meant the staff sat around for over an hour – on the clock and getting paid by the club owner – before they could prepare the room for the next show or  finish their shifts, shut down the club and leave.

Doesn’t make great business sense for a good business plan – does it?

I’m sure you can imagine the chaos this can cause for clubs that have two or three shows on a weekend night. If the first show runs even 10 or 15 minutes late because a comic goes over his time, the audiences coming in for the later shows don’t know this. They’re on time and lined-up to enter the showroom, while the earlier audience is still inside. When that audience is leaving the new audience is trying to get in and…

Well, I’ll refer to another Steve Martin quote that also works from the management point of view:

Comedy isn’t pretty.

Closed doors

I don’t need to tell you what the management and staff are saying behind the back of the comedian that went past his time and stayed on stage too long. I’ll just let you know it isn’t pretty.

The same holds true for corporate and college performers. These business people and students are usually on a schedule. It could be a training seminar, class, lunch, dinner, cocktail hour / social time – whatever. The contracts I’ve seen for these types of gigs are very strict in their performance times. Go short (leave the stage before completing the time you’re contracted for) and the clients won’t want to pay you. Go long and they won’t even think of booking you for a return engagement since you’ve disrupted the event schedule.

Of course there are other reasons why you must stick to your time on stage. The No. 1 reason for beginning comics and speakers is to prove to talent bookers and club management you understand how important this is and won’t cause a potential nightmare in the future. But in an effort not to take longer than expected when you started reading, I’ll stick to my time and sign off. I think you get the idea.

Have a comment? Please use the form below.

Thanks for reading and as always – keep laughing!

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Dave Schwensen is the author of How To Be A Working Comic: An Insider’s Business Guide To A Career In Stand-Up ComedyComedy FAQs And Answers: How The Stand-Up Biz Really Works, and Comedy Workshop: Creating & Writing Comedy Material for Comedians & Humorous Speakers.

For details about upcoming comedy workshops at the Cleveland and Chicago Improv Comedy Clubsprivate coaching by Skype or phone, and to receive our bi-weekly newsletter visit www.TheComedyBook.com

Copyright 2017 – North Shore Publishing.

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Money – how much should you ask for?

July 4, 2017

Hi Dave – The talent booker for a comedy club sent me the following: “How long is your routine and how much would you want to come to (city) to do a show?” I do 45 minutes to an hour, but on the money question I have no idea how to answer them. Obviously, I’d want enough to cover airfare. Between you and me, I’d stay with my grandmother who lives near the city. Any ideas? Thanks! – B.K.

Hey B.K. – I know the club you’re referring to. They’ve been in business for a long time and have a good reputation. And since you didn’t mention this being an offer for a one-time gig – like a holiday party, private or corporate show – I’ll assume it’s for a weekend worth of shows at the club.

Let’s negotiate…

It’s really a tough call for me because I don’t know what the club manager / owner pays his acts. It’s not an “A” room like The Improv and too many others to mention (think of the top clubs in your area), so a good guess is his price will be lower than what comics are paid in those clubs. But honestly, I don’t know that for a fact.

The bottom line is the talent booker asked you a wide open question – putting you on the spot. Between us (and readers) the guy asking you is playing his strength off your weakness. He books a club that operates every single weekend – and has for years. He knows the going rate for openers, features and headliners.

He has to because he’s been paying them.

So for him to ask YOU this question means he’s hoping you’ll come in lower than someone else just because you want to “get in” with the club.

And the fact of the matter is he’s probably right. Comedians that have yet to really establish themselves will hesitate to quote a high price. They want to work at the club, but don’t want to ruin their chances by asking for too much. The thought is that later they can negotiate a higher price when they’re a proven audience attraction.

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Comedy Workshop at The Cleveland Improv

Starts Saturday – July 22, 2017

Workshop Marquee 150

Includes a performance at The Cleveland Improv

Wednesday – August 16 at 7:30 pm

Space limited to 10 people

For details, reviews, photos and to register visit…

TheComedyBook.com

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This is part of the continual game played between bookers and newer talent. Entertainers – in our case comedians and speakers – riding high on popularity with solid credits and drawing large audiences can pretty much name their price as long as the club can still make a profit.

For example, years ago when I was booking talent for The Great Lakes Comedy Festival I contacted talent reps for two HUGE television stars (think top-rated sitcoms) for two theater shows. Hey – sometimes it’s “think BIG or go home,” right? I’ve known both comedians personally, but when it comes to business you always deal with agents and managers.

The fee I was quoted for each was even HUGER than expected and completely out of the price range for a small, start-up comedy festival. And one of the requests included use of a private jet to fly in before the gig and leave immediately after. It was part of “the fee” and not negotiable.

When your career reaches the stratosphere – that’s how you can do business.

In the case of a newer comedian or speaker, you need to have the business sense (no fear!) to ask for more information. The first question:

“How many shows do you want me to do?”

If it’s a series of shows – for instance, five shows over a weekend – ask what they pay per show. Headliners at small local clubs (think Holiday Inn on a weekend) can get anywhere from $100 and up per show. Even the major clubs have different pay rates depending on the night. For instance, they might bring in a cost-cutting headliner for a Thursday night and pay HUGE bucks for the star headliner on Friday and Saturday. It depends on the club reputation and size of audiences.

The next question:

“What do you usually pay your first-time headliners or first-time features, (or openers if that’s what you’re going for)?”

Also, do you know anyone who has played this club? Are you on good enough terms that you can contact the comedian and ask what he or she was paid? If so – do it. Comedians don’t have a union, so at least in my opinion you need to find a way to work together. Otherwise the club bookers will always have the upper hand.

* But don’t “push” this last question. Many business people (and that’s what you are as a paid performer) are very private about their earnings. Basically, it’s nobody else’s business. So please note the stipulation above: “Are you on good enough terms?” If you are and it won’t damage a friendship, then ask.

Instead of throwing an open question at you – again, hoping you play low ball – the booker should make an offer. He should come right out and say, “This is what we pay our headliners and/or features and/or openers.” And then ask if you want to work the club. Of course that’s in a perfect world and we don’t happen to live in one…

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But as far as asking, “How much would you want?” That’s what they say in the corporate and college booking worlds. And when you’re working in those markets, you should already have a price. You throw that back at them and leave room to negotiate travel, accommodations, food, merchandise and other $$$ stuff.

There are also other factors, especially in doing club gigs.

Comedians, speakers and any type of performer will need to consider his/her own track record. For instance, if a comedian consistently gets $1,000 per weekend – that’s his price. Options are plus airfare, hotel and food. The comedian tries to get his price up – and bookers try to get it down. It depends on the performer’s current popularity. If you were on TV starring in a Comedy Central special last week, you can ask for more than if your face hasn’t been seen on TV in over a decade.

In the case of a newer comedian or humorous speaker there are different considerations. Would you want to do this club as a chance to visit your grandmother? Would this club be a great credit on your resume? Are you going to make new contacts that will lead to more work?

All things you need to think about.

Your best bet is to be up front about it. Send back a message asking what they are offering. Mention you’ll most likely be happy to work within their budget, but let the booker make an offer. Then you can negotiate if necessary.

Hitchin’ a ride

For instance, he might pay you more if you don’t use a hotel room that the club would normally provide. You can stay with grandma. You might also use grandma’s car, so there’s a few more bucks you’re saving the booker that (maybe) can be passed along to you.

You also mentioned airfare. A lot of clubs today are not paying airfare – and they used to. So yes, the bottom line is that you need to cover your expenses. When you’re working a club for the first time, come up with a total you need for expenses. Then see what they offer you and if your expenses are covered. The amount of profit on top of that… well, since you’re a first-timer and weren’t on Comedy Central last week, your negotiation power might be limited.

In the end – if the club booker makes an offer – the decision is all yours. Is it worth it? Only you know for sure.

Have a comment? Please use the form below.

Thanks for reading and as always – keep laughing!

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Dave Schwensen is the author of How To Be A Working Comic: An Insider’s Business Guide To A Career In Stand-Up ComedyComedy FAQs And Answers: How The Stand-Up Biz Really Works, and Comedy Workshop: Creating & Writing Comedy Material for Comedians & Humorous Speakers.

For details about upcoming comedy workshops at the Cleveland and Chicago Improv Comedy Clubsprivate coaching by Skype or phone, and to receive our bi-weekly newsletter visit www.TheComedyBook.com

Copyright 2017 – North Shore Publishing.